If they treat Christians this way how do you think they woud treat any other non-believer.

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Andy, Dec 25, 2011.

  1. Andy

    Andy New Member

    Pakistan.

    ..thousands of Christians women are going from house to house to clean Muslim lawns, toilets, cattle stables, and carry the garbage and human waste in the basket on their heads. These women are treated inhumanely as members of the lowest class community. Their situation there is just like slaves to the Muslim masters. These women and girls are often kidnapped, raped and made Muslims. Then they are married to the Muslim men. Whenever the parents or husbands of these women approach there to take their women back, the Muslim kidnappers and police authorities scold and rebuke the Christians and tell them to go away. Now this Christian woman has embraced Islam and is now Muslim according to the Islamic Law. The Muslim woman should not reside into the Christian house. With this way the Christian families are going through the worst type of breakage, obstruction of a Christian family.
    Only in one city, Lahore, where the population is more than 5 million, 23 000 Christian women have been forced by the unavoidable circumstances brought on them by the legalized-socialized slavery system to clean toilets, houses, streets, lanes, and roads. 7000 Christian men then carry the human waste and filthy garbage on their heads, or on the bull carts going through the streets and store at the filth and garbage depots. In other words, one Christian must clean the filth made by 100 Muslims.

    http://hem.passagen.se/dpaul/
     
  2. Andy

    Andy New Member

    Ivory Coast.

    Muslim troops kill 1000 Christians at Salesian Parish Duekou, Ivory Coast

    The attackers seem to have been largely soldiers descended from Burkina Faso immigrant Muslim families loyal to Ouattara.
    Late yesterday the Roman Catholic charity Caritas said more than 1,000 people were massacred in Duekoue. A Caritas spokesman said Caritas workers visited the town and reported seeing a neighbourhood filled with bodies of people who had been shot and hacked to death with machetes.
    Blogger Chonak says, I wonder why the mainstream press (BBC) hasn’t reported the religious angle of this: they’ve just presented it as Gbagbo (the incumbent) vs. Ouattara (the challenger who won the election, according to the UN). Nice and simple. Now it’s not so nice.”
    http://cmpaul.wordpress.com/2011/04...stians-at-salesian-parish-duekou-ivory-coast/

    Nigeria
    CNN) -- Bomb blasts struck two churches in Nigeria on Sunday as worshippers were attending Christmas Day services, stirring memories of strikes against Nigerian churches during last year's Christmas season.
    http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/25/world/africa/nigeria-church-bombing/index.html?hpt=wo_c1

    Sudan

    The Khartoum government is accused of unleashing Arab militias on civilians -- a charge the government denies. The U.N. estimates 300,000 people have died and 2.7 million have been displaced in the conflict.

    Egypt
    Police stood by as Muslims beat and killed Coptic Christians and looted their homes and stores in al-Kosheh, Egypt, last weekend, Christians in the region said.

    ..."I was sitting in my field with eight relatives," Morqos Rushdie al-Gindi, a Christian farmer, told Reuters. "Three Muslim neighbors came and fired on us. They killed all of my relatives. I thought I was dead. I only regained consciousness in hospital." A Christian schoolteacher said she saw 50 men throwing gasoline bombs at Christian houses between the village of al-Balabish and al-Kosheh.
    http://www.bereanpublishers.com/Persecution_of_Christians/rioters_kill_christians_in_egypt.htm

    Muslim Mobs Burn Egyptian Churches Killing 12, Injuring Hundreds
    http://www.theblaze.com/stories/muslim-mobs-burn-egyptian-churches-12-killed/

    No outrage when Muslims are killing non-muslims yet once a Sunni gets killed by a Shia or a arab terrorist is killed by the IDF then the whole world goes into an uproar. People you are being brain washed by the media that Islam is a religion of love. There are good people who are muslims but the Koran preaches death to all who do not follow the exact teachings of Allah. Atheists you and your children will not be safe for you are also considered to be soul less and an affront to Allah.

    Kill non-believers

    4.89 : They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah's way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.
    http://nowscape.com/islam/koran_sura.htm
    8:12
    I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.
    http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/quran_teaches.htm

    Read the Koran for yourself and ask yourself if it is a blueprint for religious war rather then a book of love.
     
  3. Takiji

    Takiji Well-Known Member

    I don't see that the Bible eschews violence and barbarity any more than the Koran does, what with the Bible's instance on death for absurd "crimes", the genocide, the insistence that there is only one way and that is Christ's way (as his "Way" is variously and often contradictorily asserted by those who claim to know) and rampant and wanton cruelty generally, which would include the cursing of generations yet unborn for the sins of their ancestors, and all topped of with a supreme blood sacrifice that is somehow supposed to save us all as long as we submit. I don't know. I think I'd rather have been a Jew or a Christian in Muslim controlled Spain than a Jew or a Muslim in Christian Russia or Germany.

    The Christian holy book is every bit as nasty as the Koran is. And that is not to deny that both also contain passages of great beauty and many sentiments worthy of emulation. But I think if you are going to characterize one as a book of war you can on the very same grounds characterize the other similarly. In my view Islam and Christianity are siblings and there is a strong family resemblance.
     
  4. HollysMom

    HollysMom New Member

    Much of the violence in the Bible occurs in the Old Testament; however, one cannot blame the Bible for the genocide that is committed in its name. I think you might be taking an overly cynical position on Christianity toward Islam or Judaism or an overly generous position on Islam toward Judaism or Christianity. You are right, however, in that both Islam and Christianity have a strong relationship (along with Judaism) to Abraham. However, that is the extent of the relationship and Islam does not recognize the authenticity of either the New Testament or the Old Testament because of their various translations.
     
  5. Takiji

    Takiji Well-Known Member

    Old Testament, New Testament, One Bible. Two wings, same bird. That might be oversimplifying a bit. But when people hold up the Bible it is one book, not two. Seems to me that the New Testament would be far more effective in getting Christ's message across were it not bound literally and figuratively to the OT. But bound it is and the people who put it all together must have had their reasons. The Bible has provided the justification and the motivation for horrible things; certainly more I think than the NT could ever have provided all by itself.

    Whether the Muslims recognize the authenticity of the OT or the NT, they certainly incorporated much of the thought both good and bad. I think that the common cultural and religious aspects of the two is pretty evident.
     
  6. HollysMom

    HollysMom New Member

    On the contrary. The Bible is *always* two books, even when bound together. When many/most Christians hold up the Bible, they are holding up the New Testament, which is very frequently published as its own book. The reason the Old and New Testaments are published together is that Christianity is inevitably bound to Judaism, for which the "Old Testament" is the main religious text, the Torah. But seriously, blaming a text for the actions performed in its name is not very rational: I can still enjoy The Beatles' "White Album" despite Charles Manson calling for murder to be done because of it. The difference between Christianity and Islam, if you are making the argument about war being done in their names, is that you can point to individuals or groups of individuals who sought to do evil in the name of the faith. However, Islam calls for the destruction of nonbelievers if they cannot be converted (for all the arguments of jihad being a "spiritual war" and not a physical one, we're not currently seeing evidence of that) and in the Middle East, the children raised in the faith are raised to hate and taught how to kill outsiders. Certainly ills have been committed in the name of both Christianity and Islam, but when I was raised in my faith I was taught to pray for nonbelievers and yesterday's service was somehow lacking in the encouragement to kill anyone not of our faith.
     
  7. Takiji

    Takiji Well-Known Member

    This has not been true in my experience. The Bible is held up as the Bible, which includes both testaments. I think that yours is the sophisticated answer rather than a workaday description of reality.
    There might be a little debate on this point, but okay. However, clearly Christians through the ages up to and including now have not viewed the OT as simply background or source material or a link to Judiasim. They have seen, albeit selectively, its proscriptions and punishments, beauty and cruelty as an integral part of their faith and have acted on them in accordance with their interpretation.
    It seems to me that if you assert that the words of the Bible have had the power to influence humanity for the good then you also have to give the Bible credit for its words having had the power to move people in the opposite direction as well.
    I don't find the Christian God any more tolerant of non-believers and apostates than the Muslim one is. Even Jesus hated wobblies, or asserted that God did. And when you pray for non-believers I'd appreciate ot if you at least excluded me. I don't need praying for. I find it condescending. I have enough respect for you and your faith not to try to talk you out of it or feel that you are somehow lacking for having it. I ask the same in return for my lack thereof. Peace and love.
     
  8. HollysMom

    HollysMom New Member

    Don't worry, Tak--the whole "praying for nonbelievers" is kind of a blanket thing and is usually done in a very respectful way to acknowledge that they are also God's children. And you're right about Christ and wobblies. He even called his own disciples members of a faithless generation. I agree also that a text can inspire people to do both good and ill and the Bible is no exception. However, the *text* itself is not at fault. Human beings have it in their power to do both good and evil and different individuals may also be moved to do different things by the same words. I think it's wrong to say that the Bible is at fault or organized religion of any type is at fault, when the fault or credit really rests with the human beings who pervert or perfect the meanings of these tenets or faiths. Finally, the Old Testament is in and of itself a different book from the New Testament. It doesn't matter how it appears in the binding. Publishing the Sherlock Holmes novels as collected works in one binding does not change the works identities as short stories and novels in their own right, nor does publishing the two Testaments in one binding change the individual identities of the works. The New Testament is frequently distributed in its own binding. I have several copies that fit in a purse or a pocket, bound in faux leather bindings, which were distributed at my university (a Baptist uni) as part of the fall "welcome" to students. I'm pretty sure that the Gideons even leave New Testaments in hotel rooms instead of both Testaments bound together. When people refer to "the Christian Bible," they often mean the New Testament. It might be a "sophisticated" argument, but it is what it is.
     
  9. IQless1
    Blah

    IQless1 trump supporters are scum

    Don't forget the many versions out there, the King James version being (arguably) the most popular today, but not the only one. Throughout it's history the bible has been manipulated, intentionally mistranslated, to suit the needs of the rulers of the day.
     
    2 people like this.
  10. K Dawson

    K Dawson New Member

    A Joke:

    On an European game show the contestants are an American, a German and a Saudi. The question is "Is making love to your wife work or play?"
    The American says, "fun of course."
    The German says, "I get sweaty and out of breath, so I say work."
    The Saudi thinks hard and says, "It must be play. If it was work a Filipino would be doing it.
     

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