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Discussion in 'Politics' started by JLogan, Apr 18, 2015.
Try convincing the socialistic liberals (or the liberal socialists) that.
Yeah, try convincing liberals using an urban legend. I'm sure those liberals that believe in fairy tales will just eat this one up.
Here is the real irony. Nobody is proposing Socialism. You have people out there, probably corporate paid shills, sending out these phony email stories to try and head-off Socialism which nobody is proposing in the first place. However, if they rail on this idea of Socialism as a scythe to the neck of Capitalism, then everything they label as Socialism becomes evil. They sure know their audience.
Well, of course they're not openly proposing socialism. No one would accept that. You may as well say, "Hey, everybody, let's switch to communism". Therefore, the socialists have to do it incrementally, bit-by-bit. They've been using this tactic for a long time and, since no one seems to notice, they're getting away with it. Obamacare is just another socialist program in a long line of doomed-to-fail socialist programs.
So apparently your knowledge of Socialism most likely comes from farcical emails like the one you endorsed above. Obamacare as you call it is nothing more than government regulating an industry that has been screwing consumers to the point that government had to step in to prevent thousands and thousand of people dying from lack of private health insurance. Show me one, just one government health insurance program that isn't Medicare. Just one please. It's a little hard to call something Socialism if the government doesn't even offer the service. Do they regulate health care insurance, sure, the government regulates thousands of things but we don't call them all Socialism. You simply have no idea what Socialism is and what I wrote in post #4 is exactly right, you are being fooled by people that have a vested interest in the continued screwing of the consumer and you don't even see it. These type of phony emails convince a lot of low information folks like yourself that Socialism is coming when in reality, every single economic indicator points to the arrival of exactly the opposite. In fact, an Oligarchy of Fascists overlords is far, far more likely of an outcome.
Well, no of course you don't call them socialism. But they are, Socialist Joe. Calling them "socialism" would be like announcing your attack plans to the enemy. Don't be so blind.
The last time I checked, they had something called VA Medical. Once upon a time it was a health insurance and medical all rolled into one. But I guess you are correct. The government has so messed it up it probably qualifies as neither any more.
Try telling that to Bernie Sanders, who calls himself "Vermont's Socialist"
“The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of “liberalism,” they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened. I no longer need to run as a Presidential Candidate for the Socialist Party. The Democratic Party has adopted our platform.”
-Norman Thomas, Socialist Party Presidential Candidate in 1936 and 1940
Sanders also happens to be JoeNation's favorite senator.
So if I have your arguments right, all the economic indicators that have us moving towards corporate controlled Fascism such as destroying unions, economic control in the hands of a few elite wealthy individuals, the buying of our political system by those same individuals, and every other Supreme Court decision redefining corporations as people that we've seen in the last decade that bolsters corporate power and influence over every single one of us, that is all some Socialist plan? I have to say, those are some pretty ineffective Socialists.
Yep! The government has grown beyond anyone's control. In 1907, J. P. Morgan loaned the government money to keep it operating. Today, the top 10 business + the 10 wealthiest individuals could not touch just the just the deficit our government is operating with yearly. I believe you are correct that just a few wealth individuals are controlling the economy and their control is growth out of control, but it has nothing to to do with "corporate power and influence".
Your collective delusions aside, let's get back to the the email that started this thread. Why do you think anyone would make up a story like that and try and pass it off on gullible folks like you guys? You seemed to have moved beyond the 800 pound gorilla in the room which of course is the fact that you bought into this obvious fallacy and went right on pushing the same mantra you always push without acknowledging the false premise of your own OP. You can't dispute that on the spectrum that runs from Socialism to Fascism, this country has moved way further to the Right than it ever moved to the Left at least economically speaking. Democracy isn't incompatible with Socialism and the fact that many of our closest allies are social democracies proves the point. Fascism however, is aggressive and focused on preserving the empire. It thrashes around the world like a bully and exploits and overpowers neighbors and friends alike. If we are moving toward this secret Socialist plan, why aren't unions expanding? Why aren't people's wages increasing? Why aren't workers gaining more benefits instead of less every year? Why have workers wages been flat for over 30 years? Why are corporate CEOs wages exploding? Why is there less and less competition and more and more monopolies in more industries? By any measure, the reins of power are controlled by the few at the top of the economic ladder. Contrary to the nonsense you espouse, that is in no way Socialism.
I just proved it has drastically moved to the left. Take your blinders off.
Because they have over extended their power and become political tools of the left.
Because we have the highest tax rate in the world and the most oppressive government regulations ever. i.e. it is turning into socialism.
Until Obama took over, they were increasing.
As stated before, Obama/Lew control way too much.
Alas, having their topic completely defrocked as a silly urban legend, they stick to their ideology. Da gobermint did it. And Thanks Obama! Nothing short of a private security force showing up at their door to take them away comveniently operated by Comcast, or GE, or Koch Industries will convince the blind that they have been taken by propaganda. There were Nazi citizens that denied the death camps too. Even when they were forced to tour these death camps, they still blamed the allies and died believing that Hitler was a hero. Some people are doomed to play the role of the disbelieving citizen while they standing around the ruins of their own country and never see their own part in it's destruction. The rest of us aren't so gullible. If I am around when this comes to pass, I am not going to have any sympathy for your kind. You deserve none.
I love the way you have to make up scenarios when you get backed into a corner.
Wow! His inane rant had everything: "Da Gobermint"... death camps... Nazis... Hitler... Obama... the Koch brothers... propaganda... the destruction of our nation...
I would bet he's sitting in a corner right now, saliva drooling down his chin, eyes glaze over, rocking back and forth with his head shaking from side to side growling about he wants Hillary to have his love child. The poor thing.
And yet it was your ilk that started this thread with a false scenario. Now you can't acknowledge it and I am attacked for making up scenarios. You have to love the unabated hypocrisy of the Right wing.
False scenario? Socialism does not work? So show me where it has worked. There are lots of instances where the free markets have worked.
The false scenario is above in case you missed it. It's a made up fairy tale. If you have to resort to lies to try and make your case, you've already lost the argument.
But I digress to your change of subject and do what your ilk can't do, answer a simple question:
Top 10 Most Socialist Countries in the World
The term socialist has been thrown around quite a bit in the past few years. Not since the cold war has the term garnered so much attention in the press and from politicians. But when you look at countries who actually have a socialist economic structure, you can see some similarities to the United States – but there are some really stark differences.
Below, you will see some of the most socialistic nations in the world today:
Despite popular myths, there is very little connection between economic performance and welfare expenditure. Many of the countries on this list are proof of that, such as Denmark and Finland. Even though both countries are more socialistic than America, the workforce remains stronger.