Walker (and his minions) got it going. Now they can't conventiently stop it. He's digging his own political grave.
Really! The Legislature cannot prohibit an individual from entering the capitol or its grounds 59 Atty. Gen. 8." --The Wisconsin Constitution. If you're going to try an analogy, find one that is apt.
A union gives them the right to be heard. Without the union behind them, they can speak all they want but will never be heard. In education, we understand the difference between speaking and being heard. You obviously don't. Why did you cut the question off and ignore it? It is a perfectly good question. Here it is again. If you objected to it when you thought you saw it in Obama, why side with it when it is one of yours?
The right of the people peacably to assemble, to consult for the common good, and to petition the government, or any department thereof, shall never be abridged. Article 1, Section 4 - Wisconsin Constitution ... it goes on to state: Section 947.06, Stats. 1969, which prohibits unlawful assemblies, is constitutional. Cassidy v. Ceci, 320 F. Supp. 223. - The Wisconsin Constitution The Wisconsin Constitution gives the people the right to peacably assemble. In all fairness, we have to ask ourselves, "Are the people assembling peacably"? This could be a judgment call. I would say that if they're destroying property, disturbing the peace or otherwise creating a public nuisance or health hazard, then it would be an "unlawful assembly". If they're not destroying anything and cleaning up after themselves, then I would say it's a "peaceable assembly". Since I'm not on the scene and have no evidence to the contrary, I'll reserve judgment until further evidence is presented. I believe portions, if not all, of the Capitol could be shut down if it's deemed a health hazard or is considered to present imminent harm to the occupants.
We can trump up any reason we want I suppose. I'm going to side with the people of Wisconsin over the government of Wisconsin. They have a right to be angry and express their anger. If this Tea bagger Gov doesn't like it...Tough! There is absolutely nothing unlawful about these protesters as reported by the police department twice.
The freedom of association is a right shared by all Americans and protected by the First Amendment. In contrast, collective bargaining is a special power occasionally granted to some unions. In upholding North Carolina’s ban on government union collective bargaining, a federal court wrote in Atkins vs. City of Charlotte: “All citizens have the right to associate in groups to advocate their special interests to the government. It is something entirely different to grant any one interest group special status and access to the decision making process.” Therefore, I disagree with collective bargaining being a "right". When I was speaking of principles earlier in the thread, I was referring to the right of free speech, not the privilege of collective bargaining by a union. Please reference what I am objecting to "when I saw it in Obama". If Obama were trying to eliminate collective bargaining privileges, why would I object to that? I would praise Obama. Regardless, the point is moot because federal employees can't collectively bargain anyway.
The Capitol more than likely needs a good cleaning after two weeks of the Cheesebaggers stinking up the place. I mean, there are children there for God's sake! We don't want them harmed from noxious fumes or decaying organic matter. Gov. Walker has been lenient about their stink so far, but there will come a time when the State Health Dept. will have to step in and say "enough is enough".
Except that the state health department workers are there protesting and probably are too busy defending their rights to care what this Tea bagger Gov has to say. Name one meeting Walker has had with the unions or even the Democrats to try and solve this issue. He is not interested in their concerns and if things do eventually get ugly, it will probably be the result of the thugs he discussed planting. Shame seems to be the word that best fits this guy.
Tell me it's not a right... Labor rights or workers' rights are a group of legal rights and claimed human rights having to do with labor relations between workers and their employers, usually obtained under labor and employment law. In general, these rights' debates have to do with negotiating workers' pay, benefits, and safe working conditions. One of the most central of these "rights" is the right to unionize. Unions take advantage of collective bargaining and industrial action to increase their members' wages and otherwise change their working situation. The labor movement initially focused on this "right to unionize", but attention has shifted elsewhere.
Perhaps unions & corporations aren't so different? The unions supposedly serve the interests of the workers while the corporation serves the shareholders interests.
There is no right to collective bargaining By David Denholm 02/21/11 Protesters in Madison, Wis., and Columbus, Ohio, are defending the "right to collective bargaining." Guess what? There is no right to collective bargaining. Collective bargaining is a legislated privilege given to unions by friendly lawmakers. The federal courts have been very clear on this. A federal district court in North Carolina put it quite eloquently in a decision upholding the Tar Heel State's law prohibiting public-sector bargaining, saying, "All citizens have the right to associate in groups to advocate their special interests to the government. It is something entirely different to grant any one interest group special status and access to the decision-making process." A law granting public-sector unions monopoly bargaining privileges gives a union, a special interest group, two bites at the apple. First, it uses its political clout to elect public officials. Then it negotiates with the very same officials. When you consider that between 70 and 80 percent of all local government expenditures are personnel costs, you begin to get an idea of the magnitude of the power such laws give unions. Not only is there no right to collective bargaining in public employment, it is wrong. Collective bargaining distorts and corrupts democratic government. Collective bargaining is a process for employer-employee relations that was designed for the private sector. This process served as the model for the development of public-sector collective bargaining without taking into account the fundamental differences between the two sectors. Government is inherently a monopoly. If you don't like a decision of government, you can't check with the competition to see whether you can get a decision more to your liking. Business, on the other hand, is competitive. If you don't like the cars being made by one manufacturer, you can check with another to see whether you can find one you like better. In business, the bottom line is dollars. No matter how politically popular a business decision might be, if it bankrupts the company it is a failure. In government, the bottom line is votes. No matter how financially ruinous a decision might be, if it gets you re-elected, it is a success. More importantly, government is sovereign, while all other institutions in our society depend on free choice. Sovereignty is the right to use force to enforce decisions. We may not think about it in our everyday lives, but lurking in the background behind every government rule or regulation is the fact that government has the right and the power to use force to enforce it. We might resent that when it comes to things like taxes, but we need it when it comes to things like murder and mayhem. A sovereign institution might choose to seek input from interested parties about a decision, but when the decision is made, it is the law. How different this is from a typical public-sector bargaining situation which the union makes demands and those demands are backed up by the threat -- whether legal or illegal -- of a strike. There is a consequence to this distortion. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics in 2010, the total compensation costs of state and local government workers were 44 percent higher than private industry; pay was only 33 percent higher, but benefits cost 70 percent more. Public-sector collective bargaining was a creature of the social revolution that took place in this nation in the '60s and '70s. It was the wrong thing to do, but unlike many other mistakes it created a very powerful institution that will fight furiously against any effort to repeal or reform it. That's what's happening now in Wisconsin and Ohio and in many different ways in states all around the nation. David Denholm is president of the Public Service Research Foundation, a research and education organization that studies labor unions and their influence on public policy.
Yeah....why should employees have any right to have any say so over how much cash goes into the elitist pot? We need to further dumb down society because corporate fat cats need lower paid labor, for investing in new ventures....like Walmart. Collective bargaining just interferes with the profit margin too much. Low pay=more profit.
I wonder if the Dims, who abandoned their posts there in WI, are making their vacated offices available to the protesters or they have them locked out?
Ran across this story. Give it a read bcause you probably won't see it anywhere else. This may have been reported, but a big deal is not being made of this. "Police made a disturbing discovery today outside the Wisconsin state Capitol Building -- dozens of rounds of live ammunition. The building has been the scene of angry protests by thousands of people over Governor Scott Walker's proposal to curb the collective bargaining rights of state workers. Deputies found eleven rounds at one entrance to the building, 29 rounds at another, and a single bullet was discovered at a third entrance. "University of Wisconsin-Madison Police Chief Susan Riseling says all of the bullets were hollow points -- one of the most deadly kinds of ammunition. It's not known who left them behind." Now, imagine if this story were the same with one difference: The ammo was found on the site of a Tea Party rally. Now, let me speculate. Let's imagine that this cache of ammo was found at a Tea Party rally. Obama would immediately give a speech. The speech would make Clinton's Oklahoma City smears look like high praise. Talk radio would be condemned; the Unfairness Doctrine would be imposed. There would be so much pressure, a majority of Republicans would favor the move. Tea Party rallies would be identified as "clear and present dangers." There'd be an ammunition tax passed. Can you imagine the havoc if ammo like this was found at the site of a Tea Party rally? And yet...where are the media? The media hates guns. The media hates ammunition. Where are they? Where is this story? Who the hell has been occupying the building? Who's been raising hell at the building? Who's been trying to foment violence and who knows what? Who's been doing all the baiting? Who's wearing the provocative signs? Who's shouting the provocative words? The union types, the Democrats, their allies, and all of a sudden: "A disturbing discovery -- dozens of rounds of live ammo." Reaction? "Ho-hum. Nothing here. There's nothing to see here. We found it. Everything's cool. Everything's safe." But if this were a Tea Party rally? Ho-ho-ho-ho! "A final group of 50 protestors sang 'Solidarity Forever' as they left the State Capitol under a judge's order last night. Five stragglers were the last to leave around 10 o’clock -- and a two-week occupation of the statehouse by opponents of the governor's proposed restrictions on public unions ended peacefully. Dane County Circuit Judge John Albert ordered that by Monday, the Capitol return to its previous policy of free-and-open access whenever state business is being conducted." I don't know if you've seen it, the capitol building in Wisconsin, Madison, is one of the most beautiful in the nation, and there's now $7.5 million in damage and 41 rounds of ammunition found in this new era of "civility" ushered in by our dear president, Barack Obama. After all, these people are just our neighbors. They're our friends. We really shouldn't vilify them! They might get mad and shoot.
Thanks for letting us know what Rush Limbaugh thinks...Now there is a reliable source. Just Imagine This Headline: Live Ammo Found at Tea Party Protest
Hey Moen, Please change the channel on your TV. You have been watching Fantasy Island for far too long. Time to put on the Real World for a while! Excuse me if I have trouble feeling sorry for the plight of the public education workers in Wisconsin. I went to work today and another 50 of my coworkers lost their jobs today. The company I work for at one point employed over 5,000 employees. I believe that today's cuts leave us with less than 3,000. Do the math Moen. That is a 40% reduction in the work force. How many teachers in Wisconsin have lost their jobs due to financial cuts since 2008? My guess is ZERO.
What you need to do is form a union and get yourself some of that free retirement and free health care. After all, Moen says they are the greatest thing since slice cheese. Don't you believe him?
I have seen first hand the destruction that unions inflict on companies. Moen supports unions because he is a member and reaps the rewards. He wants you to believe that it is based on principles, when in reality it is just because it serves his own self interest. Hey, what do you think of my new avatar? Fitting huh?