Political Affiliation; 2008 Presidential Election

I found your fairy tale amusing check. As I may have mentioned at some point in the past, my wife is a college professor and she ran into a situation along the lines of this tale of yours. It happened that two hard partying frat boys took her class at the same time one semester and as it turned out one of them got enough points to merit a "B" in her class and the other earned just enough points to miss a "C" by 10 points. In all seriousness, the boy with the "B" came to my wifes office and asked if he could give 10 points to his friend so that his friend could get a passing grade, after all, he had enough extra and it wouldn't affect his "B". This isn't a convenient fairy tale with a made up ending that makes your point seem plausible. It really happened. Was it an act of generosity or just the act of someone too stupid and arrogant to even grasp the concept of college life? I know Republicans want to hold onto evey penny they can and it frustrates them on a daily basis that someone in this country may actually receive money they feel, oh sorry, they know that they clearly deserve more. Then there are the rest of us that have to suffer the fools and are equally frustrated.

Can you even imagine the look on your professor's face if you had had the grapes to even make this request? You have to wonder just how much cheating he did to even achieve the "B". The overt entitlement, lack of personal morals, and sense of arrogance displayed by the privilaged wealthy class in this country is what will do them in, not the lack of one more beemer in their driveways. But it shouldn't be thought of as unusual that they don't recognize this after all, thought isn't their forte.

As far as my buffalos go, they belong to my three boys. They are literally the only gold in the house-safety deposit box actually. I explained why I was a Democrat, why don't you explain why you can't see yourself as anything but a Republican. Let's see if it doesn't just come down to love of money.

 

My thoughts on ""Helping others out"

I don't think its fair that some people can get help if they need it or not and some could never get help no matter how bad they need it...

Further more, I don't mind helping others out, I just don't really care to help those that won't help themselves...

I have a good friend who lacks drive to hold a steady job... Over the past 10 years, along with many decent jobs he has lost 3 houses and most recently lost his wife... She left him because he never has money for bills, but has money to go hunting and drinking...

He recently wanted to borrow some money from me to buy a used bed to sleep on since he and the wife split... I did not loan him the money, as I figured he'd spend it on beer or something worse, but I gave him a brand new Mattress and Box springs set that we had extra....

A few days ago, while on my way to lunch, there was a guy at the corner with a ""Please help, Homeless Retired Vet, Will work for food sign"... I rolled down the window and said, hey, I'm going to Subway to grab me some lunch, Hop in and I'll buy you lunch... He said, he would just rather have the cash....

I run a small lawn company on the weekends for extra cash, mostly for Coins and PMs...

I'm thinking about taking it full time.... Anyway, last summer I offered to give another guy with a sign a job, told him, I'd pay 8.00 HR to start and if he showed up everyday on time I'm move him up to 10.00hr in 30days...

He was honest, declined then said, He could make more money standing here with the sign for less work...

Another good friend of mine that runs a really large lawn company has trouble getting and keeping good employees... They just don't want to work...

He has tried contacting guys through the un-employment office and they don't want to work, they just want to collect Un-employment...

So, keep working, Millions are depending on you!!!! And its your duty to give... Give, give give!!!!

Hopefully, you won't , but if you are ever in need, I'm sure the goverment guys will line up to ask what you need and make sure your well taken care of....

 

The wife (I try to help) runs a small little advertising/Mac Computer publishing business. We do pretty good, so good we hired a kid I used to work with as part-time (mainly week-ends) help. He's a GI and currently deployed, due to be back around the middle of the month. We pay him $15 an hour and his computer expertise is worth every penny, especially on special projects in-which he earns a percentage of the profit.

During his absence (6 months) we hired two individuals from the local Job-Service and regret it even now. One guy (the former) usually showed up late and once left an (NOT OURS) G4 iBook laptop in the bed of a pickup where it got rained/snowed on. The fellow then lied about it after I discovered the laptop under some soggy feed sacks where it had been for over a week. The other guy (the latter) more often than not showed up drunker than Cooter Brown which didn't cut it with me, period. Now these two (according to the Job Service) had the required skills necessary to do the job. Not much recourse I'm afraid in the case of the former, the latter is back on the market so-to-speak. You can be sure the State of South Dakota didn't buy a new laptop for the Valentine, NE School District...

If I'm going to help someone out they have to show the desire to help themselves as well.

 

great guy...in fact I have talked with him...I like is ideas on monetary reform and his views on fiat money.

 

I actually threw that question out there in the hopes that you, being a Texan, had some info about him, Drusus. Presidential material in your opinion? Not that it means anything politically, but I've read that he attended college here in Gettysburg.

Moen, your answer as to why I am as I am is coming...

 

Ok, so no "fairy tales". No rhetoric. Just simple truthful personal experience and observation... you asked.

Well, that's a nice story about the frat boys... and you don't have to convince me that it's true.

I am well acquainted with the frat boy mentality. I was the maintenance for the Theta chapter of the Sigma Chi fraternity here at Gettysburg College... that is until the college (ultra-liberal, mind you) decided to consume all of the fraternities that used to be privately owned and operated and incorporate them directly into the college. They took a 150 year old fraternity house, gutted it and turned it into a coed dorm... leaving only the small chapter room intact as a vestige of the past. In addition to destroying the history of the building, they also took a large part of my personal income away from me. All part of their agressive bid to take over as much of the town of Gettysburg as possible. Constant buying and expansion is their game in an effort to house more and more students for the sake of increasing the amount of tuition collected... Talk about love of money. Oh, and how much of that money do you think they distribute to the community that they share?

What percentage of college students do you believe would actually honestly consider such a gesture?

Now, sir, I know that you categorize conservatives in two basic groups... the evil rich and the lame brained "NASCAR conservatives" without any true intellects among us. Well, I for one and certainly not solely am frequently offended by such comments from you. It's one thing to make such remarks in jest, but you do so very pointedly. Without laying out my credentials, I will submit to you that I am neither of your classifications and suggest that you re-evaluate your generalizations.

It baffles me that you say that conservatives are conservatives because they love money above all. The greatest majority of conservatives do not fall under the classification of "rich" or even upper class nor do the majority of liberals. The majority of all is the middle, working and lower class. As for myself, I live comfortably within my means in a nice enough house (which I rent). I make enough to pay my bills and build a small savings if I budget myself right. You surely cannot call me rich. So I will suggest to you that I am a conservative because I do not have a love for money. I do not feel that because someone else has vastly more than I do, that they are obligated to distribute that wealth to me. It is their own. They worked for it and they deserve to keep it if that is their wish. It is the liberal mindset that is money loving in my view. It is envy of those that have more that drives this ideal of forced "altruism".

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. - Thomas Jefferson

I believe that in a past thread I gave my opinion on the distribution of wealth and the welfare system. I also believe that I stated that I, myself, am a product of the welfare system from childhood. I will state it again. Poverty is the summation of my childhood. My father moved us out of the Philadelphia area and up into the deep rural area of Central PA when I was in 3rd grade. My mother could not drive nor work because of a seizure condition and the closest town (pop 1200) was 7 miles away. My father drank. He did not work or when he did, he was never home on payday. He'd come home a couple of days later with $50 dollars or so for my mom to take care of the bills... mind you he was paid bi-weekly. Back to school shopping was typically a couple pairs of jeans from a second hand store. Most of my childhood we did not even have a phone and there were times that we did not have electricity. Dad would go away for days at a time leaving us behind with no way to get anywhere... except for our bikes. Now, he wasn't a heartless man, just selfish. Welfare was there to help us, so....

So, Moen, if I remember correctly, you stated at one time that you were 35 when you had your first child and that your eldest son is 13 years old... here comes the evidence of my vast intellect... check out the math skills. That should make you about 48 years old, which would make you 15 years older than I. That would have made you 27 when I was 12 and in junior high. Now, I can pretend for the sake of this that it was your tax dollars that came to support my family during that time. I can praise your generosity imposed by the government for having sustained me. In truth, I would be more angry that you allowed your government to take your money away from you and give it to my family, thus enabling my father to neglect his responsibility to his family and that because of that, I suffered the indignity of the welfare system. I was teased and ignored for being poor, for wearing the same clothes several times in the same week, for having my school lunch provided free... requiring me to display a card as I moved to the end of the lunch line showing everyone that I was "less fortunate". I lived for the weeks that I was able to take the job of "cashier" for the lunch line. Then I at least felt some sense of dignity in receiving my lunch for free. If that "help" hadn't been there, my father would have had no choice but to fulfill his obligation to us... I know well enough that he would not have allowed us to die. Who knows, maybe I'd have enjoyed it. Maybe I'd have been able to make some friends that I could actually call on the phone and make plans and do things like all the other kids. I might have even known what MTV looked like before I was out of high school and moved away.

So, please do not try to convince me of how wonderful such social programs are. Unless you have lived it yourself you cannot know the damage caused to children who must live under it.

At 20 I moved back to Philadelphia and went to work with my uncle and cousins. Uncle Nick, Angelo and JoJo are all quite rich. Uncle Nick's mansion has a foyer of marble with a large (big huge, actually) fountain in the center. Angelo and JoJo were millionaires by their early twenties. All Democrats, but don't even think about taking anything from them... they worked their books to pay what they felt was their share of tax. Nick had enough "pull" to ensure plenty of city contract work from the mayor's office... umm, well he's not mayor anymore he's the governor now. I was in line to take my place in the family fortune. I worked for about a year before I was completely sickened by the absolute corruption in the business practice of my family. I decided that I would rather be poor than to sell my soul. I walked away and have not spoken to anyone in my family there in over 10 years.

At 24 I moved into a decomissioned ambulance that I picked up for $500 and left home with $120 in my pocket.



I traveled from city to city, state to state living in my ambulance on the streets. I spent a year in that van. I found temp labor in each city and worked to get to the next. I can tell you that most companies that hire temp labor expect exactly what Ben experienced. I would be sent to a site and was always greeted coldly with the expectation that I would not be of any value. It was great. I made many people happy and was offered many full time jobs... which I turned down so I could continue traveling. Most temp laborers have no interest in working... just in getting done so that they can collect their $30 or so at the end of the day. I was doing it because I wanted to and it was part of my overall goal. Point being there are lots of people who just don't want to work. Want to know how bad it is? Go sign yourself up at your local Labor Ready spend a few days with the other laborers. Of course I spent alot of time with these people and with homeless people. I got to know them and the general mindset. You might be surprised that most of these people would lean left, after all, that's where the handouts come from. I, in my travels across 21 states, did not meet a single one who was truly just a hard luck case. Everyone that I spent time with simply did not have the ambition or desire to do anything more with themselves. I will also attest to having been ANGRILY rejected on many occasions for offering food rather than money... knowing full well depending on what area I was in whether it was crack, meth or alcohol they were really looking for. The begging children in Tijuana are the only ones that I have found that I could offer tacos instead of money and see their faces light up joyfully... at which times they would receive both from me.

No, these social programs do not help society. They enable the lazy while penalizing those who work.

You subscribe to the theory of Natural Selection, do you not? Don't these programs directly contrast Natural Selection and the survival of the fittest by sustaining the weak and allowing them to remain weak? To humanize Newton's first law of motion, a lazy man will remain at rest unless acted upon by a need to sustain himself which is equal to or greater than his desire to do nothing. To drop enough to survive into his lap will just allow him to remain at rest.

Now, aside from those reasons, let's look at practicality. In 1956, 59% of the Federal budget was used for national defence with 19% of the budget used to pay out social programs. Today 21% of the budget is set for national defence with 59% being paid out to the many social programs. At this rate of growth how long will it be until there is nothing left in the budget except the paying of social programs? Is this really supposed to be the major function of our government?

The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.- Thomas Jefferson

It is the political left that pushes for the banning of gun ownership. We've had this thread already and apparently all agree... enough said.


When we get piled upon one another in large cities, as in Europe, we shall become as corrupt as Europe. - Thomas Jefferson

You may notice if you look at the localized voting results maps that the cities almost always come out Democrat.

I'm using TJ because I know from past threads that we both have admiration for his views. I love Gettysburg. Everything I need is here and it's quite rural and quite. I live just a few minutes from the center of town, but it's all farmland and national park in my area... for now.

In the past several years, there have been more and more folks coming up from Maryland to enjoy a "simpler" life. The Gettysburg area, with the exception of those affiliated with the college is generally a conservative area. Maryland, not so much. I have watched as more and more Marylanders arrive. Housing developments are built to accomodate them. They begin pushing for codes and regulations that match those of the areas that they just left in the interest of property values. Have you ever worked a new home site in early spring? They are typically a muddy mess. My step-father and I were brought in to do some finish work on a new home, guess where the buyer was from. The driveway had not been laid yet and we had to get our tools to the house. So we put the truck into 4WD and drove up to the house. Daryl then had to run out for some material. Not long after, we were told that we had to shut down until we had gone out and cleaned the muddy tire tracks off of the road. This wasn't even in a very populated area. It was a home on the side of a mountain with no other homes within direct view. Home owners associations spring up... horrible little despotic regimes they are. Farmers are told that they have no choice but to give their land over to sale because the land would be better used for housing. All the while, these environmentally conscious, liberal Democrats are jumping into their vehicles and commuting the 40-50 miles to their jobs in Baltimore 5 days a week. I'm paying close attention as my own little township government is weighing the development of 4000 houses!!! My God, WHERE? Here's a real knee slapper. Most of the housing developments are being built by a homebuilder out of Maryland.

Now, I have never said that I could not see myself as anything but a Republican. I will, however, say that I cannot see myself as anything but a conservative. Why? Do you need more or do you get it? Do you still see my views based solely on a personal love of money?

I made a comment a few posts up about a Constitutionalist party. That wasn't really just a joke.

 

One problem is how does someone like Ron Paul actually get to be well known around the country? Seems as though only the most wealthy candidates can afford the media coverage and travel expenses. Looking at the money spent on this last election, in nearly every case (especially in New York) the highest spender won. Anyone with ideas on how to change this? There has got to be a better selection of serious runners out there than what we have.

 

Oh without doubt, I would vote for him...his speech on monetary reform won me over, inspired me to write him and he wrote back...down to earth guy...so he would never win.

Here it is:

http://www.rense.com/general75/aabol.htm

http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2006/cr021506.htm

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video 'Ron Paul ownz the federal reserve' Creating money out of thin air and the problems this causes...fractional banking, creating money on paper in unlimited supply up to 30 billion a week...big banking interests...hyperinflation caused by frational banking...etc...

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Ron Paul 'Neoconned'...he unleases on the Conservatives who are far from...Big budget, big brother, nation building, massive spending, massive growth, no limit government sp called conservative republicans...the crazy idea of lowering taxes and no reduction (expanded) to spending...how we will pay for this errant policy and the hijacking of government by neocons who are far from conservatives in most every way.

If he ran...I would only regret that I couldnt vote for him twice. He is a true conservative...smaller government, no world police, no world saviour...government out of our homes, our morals...responsible spending, responsible monetary policy...if we did what he said our money would be valued so much higher, it would be back to the days when a silver nickel bought a full meal... I truly think if more people understood home fed reserve banking (fractional banking) worked they would understand why we will always see inflation and devaluation of our currency.

 

Man, some of these posts are starting to get so long I don't want to read them! Seriously though, I already proclaimed my political affiliation- or lack thereof. I'd like to quickly comment on this idea that democrats share, and republicans are greedy selfish people. I really don't like the republican party. But my parents usually lean that direction. However, there is nothing selfish about them. They are middle-class, MAYBE upper middle class. They contribute SO much of their TIME AND MONEY to helping other people that it amazes me. They like the republican's conservative ideas, not the policies that save rich folks money. I disagree with them more often than not. But they are conservatives with hearts. My point is, I think the Republican politicians are crooks (not to say democrats aren't), but the people that vote for them aren't always bad. Thats my rambling for the night.

 

I completely agree with that thought, and I actually never read any post that doesn't fit on the screen without scrolling.

 

My apologies. My post was mostly for Moen. You can't simply say that you don't believe in the redistribution of wealth because you'll simply be labeled an evil money lover. You can't say that you like to see things stay simple because that's not progressive and it shows intolerance... So, I spelled it out this time.

 

DEMOCRATS:
You have two cows.
Your neighbor has none.
So?

The government comes in and takes one of your cows and gives it to a poor Democrat in Minnesota. They place a tax on the milk from the second cow you have to pay for the feed required to maintain the first cow. Everyone is happy and Moen goes on collecting coins and pretending he doesn't like wealth and the easy way of life. And the beat goes on, and the bear goes on! La-de-deee, La-de-daaa!

 

Well, that's a shame... You should read Check_M_All's post. In fact, EVERYONE should read his post.

Check, I admire the direction you've taken in your life.

 

I found it to be an interesting read, and coming from a person who had a bit similar circumstances, I relate...a bit refreshing to read a real post and not a page full of cut and paste.

BTW...this is the house I used to live in...I was dirt poor but never once got one welfare...

 

Although he is highly qualified, Ron Paul probably has no chance of being elected because of his personal background and lack of financial backing. The big money owns the presidency, and Paul is not their choice. I'm sorry to say it, but this probably can't be changed at this point. Barring a near miracle, the political system is broken beyond repair.

 

Check,

First of all thank you sharing your story in such detail and heart-felt honesty. You seem like a pretty upright individual who if I met in my community, I'm sure I'd admire. I think that your life story just proves that trying to lump people into Democrats/Republicans, Conservatievs/Liberals breaks down rather quickly once you get to know the people behind the labels. I don't know if I can address everything you brought up here because I have much to get accomplished this Monday morning but I'll try to be brief. Sometimes in an effort to be concise, I cut to the chase and it can sound rather terse to others but my aim isn't to offend just to explore as many opinions as possible without losing focus on the issues. Anyway, here goes...

I lived at the University of Minnesota campus on frat row, not in a frat, for a couple of years and had quite an eye-full of the shananigans that happened regularly in the frat houses. Many campus' are looking at banning frats these days in an effort to clean up the campus' and expanding campus property is just one way to do that. I saw everything from gang rapes to amazing levels of drunken violence by the members of the fraternaties that surrounded our building. I wouldn't judge all fraternaties by these incidences but nor would I allow my children to belong to one either. Fraternaties are overwhelmingly conservative although you can find just about any political persausion associated with a fraternaty. I used to just think of them as wealthy little rich kids gone wild. That was probably an oversimplification of the situation but it was reinforced by bad behavior again and again.

I don't know?

You're right, they are just generalizations and stereotypes. I don't really believe that those two categories capture every Republican anymore than you really believe every Democrat is trying to tax anyone with money and give it to those that do not want to or will not work. I do believe that those two categories capture a good percentage of Republicans. What percantage, who can really say? Republicans are a minority in this country but a solid voting bloc or else they'd never win a national election. As far as intellectuals go, not all Democrats are intellectuals either. But again, a much higher percent of the intellectuals in this country are Democrats rather than Republicans. What percentage, again, who really knows?. That would depend on how you defined intellectual I suppose. Some people here pick at me about my superiority complex when all they have to really evalute me by is my writings. Does that make me an intellectual? I do like higher ideals and get annoyed with overlysimplistic views but I'm just rambling. Next question:

This paragraph is interesting because you haven't told me what makes you a Republican, you can't even define yourself as a Republican without talking about money or the Democrats supposed interest in taking your money. If you ask a Democrat what makes them a Democrat, money never comes up. They certainly don't define themselves in opposition to Republican values but you can't ask a Republican what makes them a Republican without going right to the issue of money. That is what I mean when I say money is what is being worshipped, not that Republicants build alters out of cash and bow to them. Do you see what I am saying?
As a Democrat, the thought of more taxes on the rich to give to poor people makes me ill. I think the government has plenty of money to help those that genuinely deserve help. Wealth redistribution is just a conservative catchphrase that takes the focus off of using the money we already paid to the government for worth while social programs. What is a government for if not to help as many people as it can with our collective national pot. If people out there have lived off of the welfare dime generation after generation, they need to be thrust back into the role of productive citizens. Government can't do everything but it should help where private industry can't. The problem is that private industry through high medical costs and such can't afford to shoulder the burden of providing for it's workforce these days. Someone has to provide for the working poor and if not government, then who? If we create an underclass of poverty in this country, you'll wish for the days of welfare lines and government handouts because if an entire class has nothing to lose by revolting, they'll do it.

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. - Thomas Jefferson

Sounds like a pretty rough childhood, but don't confuse an alcoholic parent with a broken welfare system. It wasn't the welfare system that allowed your father to drink, in reality, it was probably your mother. Every alcoholic needs a system of enablers, usually a spouse, or other family member(s). It is hard to recognize enablers because they are usually caring, giving, generous tolerant people, the last ones you'd blame for someone else's drinking problem. No one forced your father to get drunk but no one forced your mother to put up with it either.

Good memory and good math also. As I said above, it wasn't the government that allowed your father to drink, and I know how hard it is to blame the one parent that cared about you the most, but it is a pretty wild stretch to pin your father's alcoholism on the welfare system. I was not wealthy as a child. I was one of 9 kids. My father worked 12 hours a day, 6 days a week for 45 years for the same company. Even working as much as he did, we struggled and even lost a home in that time. I'm sure we received government help from time to time although I can't really remember what kind or when. With 9 kids, you sort of automatically qualify. I know about alcoholism because for some portion of my life, I also had an alcoholic parent. You don't have to tell me how hard it is to live with and all things you live without, I've been there. I'd be willing to bet you didn't so much leave home as ran away from it and all the problems you grew up with.
Blaming the government for all of your problems is as senseless as depending on government to solve all of your problems.

Sounds like East Coast corruption practices are still alive and well. This isn't a Democratic or Republican thing, it just the East Coast way of doing things.

Cool photo. You look like you are out for some adventure.

Of course they help people. You only focus on the percentage that abuse the system because it makes your already held beliefs seem correct. Sure there are some that abuse and use the system, but what about all those that just needed a temporary leg up and went on to become functioning contributing members of society? Just throw them all out because some choose to abuse the system? That only compounds the negative effects of those that just abuse. How does that make any sense? Nail the abusers without hurting the truely needy. Is that so hard to imagine?

Darwin's natrual selection was never intended to be applied to societal structures. The nazis used this logic to justify the supiority of the "arian race". It is a biological theory that applies to mindless organisms not intelligent societies. Besides, it's a kind of cold way to view your fellow humanbeings.

I don't have the time to look up the validity of these figures but I will later. I know the military budget today is the single largest budget we have. We spend more on our inappropriately named "defense" budget than all other countries defense budgets in the world combined. If there has been an actual decrease in percentage of the military budget since the 50's, and we're still out pacing every other country combined, maybe we were spending too much in the first place. Don't get me started on spending money on people rather than bombs.

And that is a total misstatement...They push to ban certain types of assault weapons, whereas, the Right wants to prevent the banning of any type of weapon. Which sounds like the saner option?

Rural areas especially the western half of the country vote Republican. It's been this way for a long time. Farmers and ranchers don't look at large land owner tax breaks and farm subsidies as government welfare but if you live in HUD subsidized housing in the city and own nothing, you are a welfare case worthy of starving to death. Go figure.

Yes! If you don't mind. Tell me why you are a Republican without using money, redistribution of money, democrats desires for your cash, etc. If it isn't all about the money, then tell me something that doesn't include money in your answer. Good luck. I've yet to see a poster here tout Republian "values" without mentioning money. So try and tell me that money isn't a Republican's primary motivation and I'll tell you that you are either fooling yourself or just plain lying. I need more to motivate my convictions than material wealth. That is why I'll probably end up dying as a Democrat.

There hasn't been a threat to our constitutional rights as great as we are currently experiencing from the Republican in the White House in our history. I can't see anyone seriously being for the constitution and what it stands for and backing this president in any way. His assault on our basic rights has no parallel as he tries to consolidate as much power into the executive branch as he can get away with. We will recover from this but many people will have suffered in the mean time when they shouldn't of had to.

 

I understand many of the points that you made, Moen and considered many of them even as I was writing my post. However, in the interest of "relative" brevity, I will stick to the money/why issues.

Money does become the big issue when you view the full picture. Again, I will say I am conservative. I will vote whatever direction I believe will work in favor of a smaller more focused government that puts more power back into the hands of the people. Of course money is important in that view point. It has nothing to do with how much I keep for myself. It has to do with how much the government takes or creates in order to expand itself deeper and deeper into our lives... through many social and government (defence included) programs.

It takes money to grow the government. It's not the money that the government takes that concerns me. It's the growth of the government and that as the government grows, it becomes much more than money that they take. They take power from us as citizens. This is the true conservative ideal... that people are able to do for themselves. They do not need the government to control, regulate, subsidize and fund every aspect of their lives.

The problems that we face in this country are, in my opinion, a direct result of the growing power of the government and the loss of power among the people. Each step takes us further and further from our beloved democracy. Each program builds a host of new problems that can only be resolved by a new program which will in turn create its own problems... which can only be resolved... well, you get the point.

The only way to stop this cycle is to cut off its lifeline, and that lifeline is the flow of money. The ability to tax, borrow, print money unchecked is destroying the standard of living for Americans at an increasing rate, while allowing the government to expand... now as Americans standard of living erodes, where do they have to turn? Government programs... They cause the problem so that they can provide the solution and justify the growth.

It is like a pharmaceutical company releasing an unknown strain of bacteria for which they've already developed a cure, waiting until the illness has taken effect and then riding in to save the day with their miracle. Of course, they are running around providing the cure for free to all of those who are infected, they're heroes after all, but everyone will be paying extra for their aspirin and cough syrup. Whew, thank God for them. They're saving us all.

I am not anti-government. No nation could survive without a strong government. I am, however, against government that does not believe in the ability of the people to care for themselves.

You ask me why I am a Republican, and I have no answer beyond the hope that one day one of them will actually push what they are supposed to stand for. I do not see myself as a Republican. I see myself as a conservative.

I am a conservativenot because I want to hold on to every penny, but because I want a government that believes that I and everyone else are capable AND responsible for taking care of ourselves. I do not want a government that believes its purpose is to babysit and dole out allowances.

 

Thanks, CoinOKC, but I don't think it's anything worth admiring... just the path that I wanted to take... and in that sense is as selfish as any other path.

OKC... Assuming Oklahoma City? I spent some time there. I worked at the U-Haul self storage building with the giant U-Haul truck on the roof doing clean up and repairs. There was a boys club or some kind of youth organization whose parking lot was my yard. I remember a beautiful young lady who worked there. She had absolutely no interest at all in some hippy looking freak who lived in an ambulance, but she let me fix her computer... which resulted in my forgetting an entire box of software disks when I left for Amarillo. Ah, the mind dulling effects of beauty.

 

Thanks for sharing that, Drusus. Hey, is that you in the lower left?

Thanks for the Ron Paul info and links. If he's all that he seems, then he's my guy for sure.

 

Well I guess that is what you get for creating a monster post. It really is hard to address all of the issues brought up in that large of a posting. What's important is that you stated how you actually felt about different issues without searching all over the internet for other peoples words to say what it is you believe. You'd be amazed how often people can't speak for themselves.

As I said and I believe you concluded, it is difficult to define being Republican without including money in the definition. If we were talking about just the pot of money that currently exists and nobody was taxed at any different rate than anyone else, how would you like to see the government spend the taxpayers money it collected? That is really the only issue that differs between the two parties.

One party would fund the military and large corporations into the stratosphere and throw mentally impaired people into the streets to fend for themselves and the other party would restrict military spending, create wasteful social programs, and raise the minimum pay of the poorest workers among us. I don't much care if I and everyone else is being taxed at a fair rate that allows me and them to live as well as can reasonably be expected given my socioeconomic position and the government is providing decent roads, public services, and protections against crime and foreign invaders.

Everybody wants the government to spend tax money on their priorities and not the other guys. It's not possible to please everyone so different groups lobby for their causes and money changes hands and certain priorities get addressed and the rest don't. Whoever can afford to lobby for their priorities with the biggest fist full of cash gets the biggest share of the taxpayer pot. Is that you and I or is that the wealthiest corporations and wealthy elite of this country? Do you really believe these wealthy individuals care one iota about how much you or I are taxed? They lobby for what they want and get you to vote for it by buying your vote for what they must consider pocket change. Mantras like smaller government, lower taxes, less regulation, distribution of wealth, all benefit them far more than you could ever imagine.

I came to the realization many, many years ago that people who weren't wealthy sided with and supported those that wouldn't allow a working class person to wipe their feet on a rainy day. I originally thought that these people must be complete idiots to keep their masters in such opulence at their own expense. I have since realized that people buy into what they are told if it is presented to them in terms they think they understand even if they really don't. Republicans don't help working class people because it impacts wealthy people adversely. Any number of votes on minimum wage increases, workers rights, union support, etc. should be enough to allow even the slowest among us to come to the conclusion that working class folks aren't exactly a priority for the Republicans. Yet, they still receive a sizable amount of support from some that live in poverty. You got to wonder if that isn't Darwin's theory playing itself out.

Look, I am probably more wealthy than you and even I think the Republicans are grabbing too much of the shared pie. If you don't, you only have yourself to blame for your place in the socioeconomic ladder. All I want is for people to look after each other, give when you can, take if you truely need, and work towards the common good of all. Is that really such an unreasonable stance? If it is, maybe we have already lost our way and deserve the consequences we have earned.